Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

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Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by Trooper on Sun 16 Feb 2014, 09:04

One of Canada’s most high-profile military leaders claimed more than $72,000 in expenses, including real estate fees, for a move from his Ottawa home to another residence in the city after he retired, CTV News has learned.

Documents obtained by CTV News show retired general Andrew Leslie, who once led Canada’s mission in Afghanistan, claimed the expenses for a move in 2012.

Leslie retired from the military in 2011, but members of the Canadian Forces are entitled to expense one last move after they retire.

Critics, however, are calling it a “shocking” amount.

“That’s a shocking figure considering that the military is dealing with budget cuts and says they don’t have enough money for wounded soldiers,” said Steven Staples, president of the Rideau Institute, an Ottawa-based research, advocacy and consulting firm.

“To spend that amount to move a general down the street, there’s just something wrong with that,” Staples said.

Ottawa came under fire for closing eight Veterans Affairs offices earlier this year. Veterans protested the decision, saying that closing the offices would hurt their ability to access services. The government has said it would be moving many of the services offered online and will provide a Veterans Affairs specialist at some 600 Service Canada locations across the country

Pat Stogran, Canada’s former veterans affairs ombudsman, was also critical of Leslie for claiming the expenses.

It’s terribly demoralizing to be witnessing a general who will reap the benefits for such a paltry move,” he said.

The house Leslie moved to in an upscale neighbourhood in the nation's capital is just a four-minute drive from his former residence, a home that property records show sold for more than a million dollars.

In a statement to CTV News, Leslie was adamant that he did not break any rules.

“The Department of National Defence handles and pays all the costs for packing, shipping… The overwhelming majority of the expense is certainly the real estate fees,” the statement said.

Leslie is expected to run for the Liberals in the next federal election and he is a keynote speaker at the party’s convention next week.

Leslie made headlines in 2011 when he told the Harper government in a landmark report that the Department of National Defence needed to take an axe to its bloated headquarters in order to meet future obligations. The Department of National Defence could not be reached for comment about the moving expenses Leslie claimed in 2012.



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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by RemembermefromHalifax on Sun 16 Feb 2014, 09:46

If you consider Real estate fees on his move they probably make the greater portion of the claim. If his house in that area of Ottawa was 700000 to 1 million nothing out of the ordinary and fully expected. Can you imagine Harpers moving fees when he's gone in 2015?

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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by Guest on Sun 16 Feb 2014, 10:39

agreed remember this is a non-issue.

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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by Trooper on Mon 17 Feb 2014, 19:48

Former top-ranking Canadian general Andrew Leslie says his connection to the Liberal party is what’s prompting a smear campaign over $72,000 in expenses he claimed for a move from his Ottawa home to another residence in the city shortly after he retired.

Meanwhile, the minister of national defence said Sunday the government intends to examine the costs that appear to be “grossly excessive” and questioned Leslie’s judgement for billing taxpayers.

I thought the mention of wounded soldiers in my above post was interesting with respect to this statement “That’s a shocking figure considering that the military is dealing with budget cuts and says they don’t have enough money for wounded soldiers,”



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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by RemembermefromHalifax on Mon 17 Feb 2014, 19:57

The only reason the CONS have started this is because the General is a member of the liberal party and we all know how cruel and mean spirited this Harper Government has become. Really as a life long conservative supporter I can't wait until they truff this guy.

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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by Guest on Mon 17 Feb 2014, 20:34

let me see a 10% commission on a million dollar plus home is 100 plus grand so im guessing he got a a deal on the commission say 5% and saved the taxpayers some money.

good for him just because its not his money doesn't mean you cant talk deal?

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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by Trooper on Tue 18 Feb 2014, 05:45

Here is another Headline making news - "DND paid $40K for disgraced former general Daniel Menard's move"

The Department of National Defence paid nearly $40,000 to move a disgraced former brigadier-general from the Montreal area to the United Arab Emirates, according to the same documents that brought to light another former general’s controversial $72,000 move within Ottawa.

According to the documents, the department paid the $40,000 to move former brigadier-general Daniel Menard, who was demoted and later pleaded guilty to having improper relations with a subordinate, so he could take up his new job with private security firm GardaWorld as head of its Afghanistan operations

The documents that shed light on Menard’s move are the same that showed that taxpayers paid $72,000 to move retired lieutenant-general Andrew Leslie from one home in Ottawa to another a four-minute drive away in 2012. The figure includes moving costs and real-estate fees.

In all, the defence department has covered nearly $600,000 to move dozens of generals and admirals over the past five years either within the same city or just outside the city limits, the documents show.

Defence Minister Rob Nicholson says that the federal government is now reviewing the policy. “The policy was never intended to have taxpayers pay $72,000 for generals to move between mansions within the same city,” Nicholson said.

Two different moves, from two different General's, two different situations, interesting to learn that a review of the policy that has been in place for ever, is now under way. This could end up in some change in policy.





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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by bigrex on Tue 18 Feb 2014, 23:00

Unfortunately, any change will only be to the detriment of all soldiers, not just top Generals. To me this entire thing is a non issue. Maybe the Tories should be addressing their Senators who spent roughly the same amount of money just in travel expenses over a 3 month period. This including the Senator from Toronto, who spent over $12000, for a 20-30 minute flight to Ottawa for him and his wife. Was it legal? Yes, just as legal as the Generals moving expenses, but still far more than the average Canadian would deem reasonable. They could just as easily hopped in the car and drove the 4 hours at a fraction of the cost, as well as mitigated the requirement for a rental car while in Ottawa. In fact, since Leslie's new home is in Ottawa, and he plans of entering politics, he could be saving taxpayers quite a lot more than $72000 just in traveling and secondary housing expenses, that he would be otherwise entitled to if living elsewhere.
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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by nemo on Wed 19 Feb 2014, 02:32

And how did the CTV get the info on the General? If the public can look at the General's claim for moving, then they could look at all retired members who claim a move.

This is politically motivated. Leslie is not the first general to move when he retired. Most of the cost of the move would have been real estate fees.

unfortunately, this govt looks poised to take away this benefit. To justify the cost of increasing our portion of the PSHCP, they say 'well, in the private sector, they don't get this so neither should you.'

If this govt wants to take away this benefit or reduce it, then they damn well better start paying overtime to soldiers. After all, in the private sector you would never get away with having someone work 80 plus hours a week for the same pay as working 40.

This govt sickens me. They shaft the serving members and the veterans.

Gregory Thomas, federal director of the Canadian Taxpayers Federation says that General Leslie should not have taken advantage of what he was entitled to. Thomas thinks Leslie should be ashamed and that Canadians will lose respect for him. BULL.

Thomas compares Leslie to Mike Duffy who is being charged with fraud for taking funds to which he was not entitled to.

Thomas says, “In 2014 to have some of our most beloved military heroes behaving this way with their expense claims, he’s gone from being a hero to being the Mike Duffy of the Canadian military.”

Well Thomas, your opinion is wrong and defamatory.

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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by RobbieRoyal on Wed 19 Feb 2014, 06:20

I was entitled to a move, your entitled to a move, he is, she is, they are and they all will be entitled however the whole reason anyone reads into the hype, simply He wants to be a Liberal. Thats it nothing more nothing less political bashing at the tax payers expense, I am more pissed at the fact that Leslie has the ability to assist veterans and while he was in service he did not help in fact he turned a blind eye on the plight of the veteran so what is going to change who knows.
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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by Guest on Wed 19 Feb 2014, 07:03

boys you all got this right their is not a lot of love for this guy here but right is right. I got a final move ya it was cheaper but I was only selling a home of far less value. this is just a way for the tories to kill two birds with one stone. they will amend the posting allowance and final move and it will not be rank specific . how many pte/cpl types and all other ranks get posted every year? how many generals? yup they took from disabled soldiers through the NVC serving soldiers through the retirement allowance next they will take from the serving and retiring by cutting these allowances. they get to bash a political enemy in the proses wow right by their own playbook. these guys are way to easy to read.

next up big spending in the next budget ( election budget ) on short term mostly some long term programs will get a boost but ones they know they can cut from the following budget.

why cant these guys try something different for a change common surprise us.

always question authority
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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by Trooper on Wed 19 Feb 2014, 12:19

Update on Daniel Menard,

Daniel Ménard, the disgraced former Canadian brigadier-general held in an Afghan jail on gunrunning charges, has been released from prison, CBC News has learned.

Ménard had been imprisoned since January in his current role as an executive for private security company GardaWorld.

A newspaper carrying a report from Kabul on Jan. 30 alleged Ménard's run-in with the law centred on accusations of possessing military equipment without permission, including 129 rifles and 148 radios.

Later, GardaWorld told CBC News the "issue has been resolved" and that Ménard's release "should happen imminently."

Ménard was formerly a military commander for Canada's mission in Afghanistan. His tenure in the country was cut short in 2010 when he was charged with fraternization for having a sexual liaison with a female subordinate.
He was charged and later pleaded guilty to two counts of conduct to the prejudice of good order and discipline, in violation of the National Defence Act.

It was recently revealed National Defence paid nearly $40,000 to move Ménard to the United Arab Emirates, according to a set of documents containing expense records for the military's top brass.
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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by Trooper on Wed 19 Feb 2014, 13:17

I fully agree that our last move should be paid, taking that away would in my view be cruel and unrealistic. The question asked should be this, if one could afford to purchase a million dollar home, should one be able to take advantage of this claim. This is where I think they should be looking at, if they intend to make any changes, I saw a report of 12 different generals who claimed their last move , Leslie's was the highest at $72000, the lowest was under $500, yes that's correct $500. So yes Leslie was within his rights, when he claimed $72000, but was it the proper thing to do, maybe, would I have done the same thing, absolutely, why, because I'm entitled to it. Bottom line here is that, don't make changes to this policy, to those that are not in this high pay grade. This way I think that we can continue to receive this benefit without any public objections, this way in my view would be fair.

My opinion only.
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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by Real truth on Wed 19 Feb 2014, 13:36

Maybe the million dollar home was purchased with help from his spouses income. Maybe she is a professional and in Ontario two professionals working in a metropolitan area could very easily have a million dollar plus plus home. Different circumstances dictate I believe keeping this rule the same. When you retire you get your last move paid. If its expensive so be it. If not oh well. Could this not be another example of the CONS looking at any excuse to kill another benefit. Once we start taking things away they are gone.

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Re: Retired-general-claimed-72k-in-expenses-for-move-within-ottawa.

Post by bigrex on Wed 19 Feb 2014, 15:41

Not to mention with inflated housing prices, a million dollars, in Ottawa, won't get you the same level of home that it would have, even 10 years ago. So, the house he purchased could be a relatively modest three or four bedroom home, far from a mansion, but carried a hefty price tag, solely for its location. The only question I have is, was he required to move? It is one thing if he was living in one of the few remaining PMQ's in Rockcliffe, and had to move out upon retirement, but if he had been in a home that he had purchased, but took advantage of the cost move to simply upgrade, then the move was unreasonable.
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