Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

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Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by 6608 on Mon 01 Jun 2015, 17:51

Here is the latest info on lawsuit "Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election" at link more details

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/veterans-government-put-benefits-lawsuit-on-hold-until-after-election-1.3095799

thoughts anyone?

Cheer's
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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by teentitan on Mon 01 Jun 2015, 18:38

Well to wait a year this tells me they (Equitas) want to see if the "loosening" of adjudication/PIA etc happens.

The Social Covenant is a done deal it's in the omnibus bill

This leaves one single point which IMO is important...increasing the Lump Sum to at least match the average of all the Provinces/Territories.

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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by redfisher on Mon 01 Jun 2015, 19:50

Looks like the Government won again! Never, never give the benefit of the doubt to those who have proven themselves as two faced. Never. If you do you will only get screwed. I guess the Equitas lawsuit is now officially dead in the water. Just think of all the time and effort wasted by Equitas...sad.

The Government lawyers must be having a hell of a party right now. I wonder if they will get a bonus for shutting down Equitas so effectively?
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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by teentitan on Mon 01 Jun 2015, 20:06

Don't know why you would say that redfisher....the lawsuit was about the social covenant and compensation.

The lawsuit won the social covenant. Equitas is now saying we will give your new ways a year to see if the compensation increases and is not strictly denied as in the past.

The GoC was/is afraid of the lawsuit or they would have stood their ground. It's the GoC that lost not Equitas.

Don Sorochon worked hard to get where he is today. Do you think he wants his legacy in law to be "he ran away scared from the Government of Canada?

Don Sorochon and the plaintiffs have done a service to veterans and future veterans who fall under the NVC and for this I am thankfull and applaud them.
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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by Guest on Mon 01 Jun 2015, 21:06

WOW what a huge mistake . looks like a complete failure .

this whole case was because of the buyout and the case came with perfect timing .

if you cant sway the GOC prior to an election you sure as heck are not going to do it after that a fact everyone here without a doubt knows .

one major issue THE BUYOUT .

has any of the minuscule improvements addressed this issue in any way shape or form????

NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!

is there equality ??????

NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!

complete and utter failure .

propat

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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by Guest on Mon 01 Jun 2015, 21:37

Ya huge mistake. In no way sape or form should this have been put on hold. I guarantee and agree the GOC I'd partying....at least for now. The lump sum is bull*hit. Guess someone else needs to step up now. Failure IMO. Licensed in law....if I was the GOC....I would be singing the happy dance.

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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by bigrex on Mon 01 Jun 2015, 23:53

I agree that this is a poor decision on the part of the Equitas lawyers. We had momentum and timing on our side, but now, the Tories can feel more relaxed during the election, over Veteran issues. You know that, even if asked about the lawsuit, they will say that veterans were happy with the improvements that they made, and chose not to proceed with the lawsuit, even though it is only a half truth. The only thing that I can think of, is that the CIB, even though so few will get it, enough of the lawsuit Veterans will qualify, that it has taken the wind out of their sails. It would be hard to point at those guys and say that they didn't receive adequate compensation for their injuries, after they just cashed a cheque for $70k each. I'm not saying that is definately what happened, but it is the only logical reason behind the delay.
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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by Guest on Tue 02 Jun 2015, 00:49

well I imagine this suit will be picked up again eventually by someone else its just to bad the such great timing was wasted on this one.

propat

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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by redfisher on Tue 02 Jun 2015, 01:05

Yes it is very good that there is now, in writing, that Canada has an obligation towards Vets yet those are just words. Nice words but.....well that was it. Nothing else.

So we have some nice words and the CONS are patting themselves on their backs as they just missed the bullet.

I am absolutely amazed that it ended this way. Just words and no results.

To put his in perspective my EX promises me all sorts of things, when she wants something, and I have this in black and white. At the end of the day I get screwed over but maybe by May 2016 things will get better. She says it will....in the meantime she enjoys the spoils of war.
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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by Dannypaj on Tue 02 Jun 2015, 07:00

ONE VOICE

Michael Blais
Paul, we will not be silent and we will make the plight of veterans an election issue. I promise you, we will adapt, we will overcome, we will prevail on this issue.

Paul Franklin
of course im involved... ha ha

Paul Franklin I just dont like when people tell me to shut up because they dont THINK I know what I'm talking about.

ill stand on my record

Paul Franklin Love this line.

Paul Franklin "Aaron Bedard"
Harold and Don want to talk to you and have talked to several other "advocates" today. If you want to speak about the case you should know what your talking about.

Paul Franklin
Actually for all advocates or as they call us "advocates" and leaders of vet groups and such.... before the federal election (most likely this summer we will have to have a meeting with the only goal of creating a unified voice

Paul Franklin
wow it has officially devolved into something personalllll

This showcases exactly my point that they are NOT fighting for quality

This will give insight to what needs to  happen in order to get our voices heard.  Mr. Paul Franklin has spoken and would like all  Veterans to come together with one voice.
 I wanted to share this feed with the csat folks in case you missed it on Facebook.
When an issue due to the neglect of the GOC becomes personal to a Veteran and a resolution has been proposed by all veteran's groups and the GOC is not acting or moving towards resolving the problem, then Veterans and not lawyers will have to force the hand of the GOC.  Equitas lawsuit maybe standing down but as soldiers and Veterans we need to continue our fight and demand what we want and deserve.

Bombard the media outlets! Tell the media how disappointed Veterans feel and how the GOC actions does not reflect how Canadian Veterans should be treated and compensated.
Keep the momentum going it hasn't stopped but has now gone full steam ahead.
With Mr. Paul Franklin speaking up and speaking against what has happened we need to stand as one.
There is no I in team. We are all fighting for the same outcome!  
Which is the Best care a Veteran and their family deserve.
..........................................................................................and as of now it doesn't look like the GOC being an election year is willing to silence us by doing the right thing!
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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by Riddick on Wed 03 Jun 2015, 10:44

I suspect the Equitas Society has information we don't (yet). Although most of us want resolution (fair resolution) sooner than later, it is a fact of life with lawyers in general. Just look at how long an individual has to fight for a claim ......wait.....wait.......deny.......wait.... appeal.....and more waiting.......we all know it is very frustrating, so why should this be any different.

The Harper government can see the writing on the wall and is already starting to make excuses on behalf of Harper.

We cannot become divided regardless how hopeless we may feel.........there is strength in numbers my friends..........hang in there.

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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by teentitan on Wed 03 Jun 2015, 10:49

We are writing to you because you have reached out to us in the past regarding your interest in being involved in or obtaining information about the class action lawsuit brought against the Government of Canada on behalf of Veterans who have been effected by decreased compensation under the New Veterans Charter.



As you may have heard in the media or through your friends and colleagues, there have been recent settlement negotiations with the Government on this lawsuit. As a result, we wanted to provide an update to as many Veterans as possible to properly inform everyone about what has occurred.



The first point we want to make clear is that the lawsuit has not settled. Earlier this year, following the appointment of Minister O’Toole, the government, and specifically representatives of the Minister, reached out to the representative plaintiffs and counsel on this lawsuit to see if the parties could work together to resolve the issues in this litigation. To that end, we have met with the government many times over the last several months and have expressed our concerns about the lack of benefits as well as problems in the culture at VAC, and shared our recommendations for further change.



As you may know, the Government has recently tabled legislation (Bill C-58) containing proposed reforms that will require legislative enactment. While these changes are not enough for the parties to agree to settle the lawsuit, we see these proposed changes as a positive first step. For the first time since the lawsuit commenced three years ago the Government has shown an intention to take steps and open a dialogue with us towards proposed change and therefore this is the beginning of the process we were hoping to make with this lawsuit. However, it is not enough to settle.

What has occurred, is that the parties have agreed to hold off on the court processes for one year, in order that we can continue negotiations and work with the Government towards further proposed reforms.



It is our view that a negotiated resolution to this lawsuit is in the best interests of Veterans for several reasons. Chief among them is the frailties of the legal process and the need for an efficient solution to getting better benefits for those suffering now.



First, it is important to realize the frailties of the litigation process. When we started this process the Government brought an application to strike out the case arguing that the Veterans did not even have the legal right to sue the Government for decreased benefits. There is quite a lot of case law out there that suggests that a government is entitled to spend their money any way they see fit. What we are arguing for is a novel exception to that which is that the government has a special obligation to veterans that requires them to provide adequate and fair compensation for injuries suffered in service to the country. While this view seems obvious and would carry the day in the court of public opinion, there is no law on the books to support it. Currently the matter is before the Court of Appeal and they have yet to render judgment. The Government attempted to abandon this appeal in Court on Monday, however unfortunately, the Court would not allow the appeal to be abandoned as argument had already been heard by the Court. Instead the Court of Appeal ordered that the Appeal also be held in abeyance for a period of one year. Therefore there remains a risk that the Court could reject our argument and strike out the case entirely, resulting in a bad legal precedent for Veterans going forward. Whether we win or lose in the Court of Appeal the matter would likely proceed to the Supreme Court of Canada and we again cannot be certain that the outcome would be successful there. All this is to say that we still have a long legal battle ahead just to gain the right to sue at the trial court level.



The next issue with the legal process is that the ultimate victory that we could receive would be merely a declaration of invalidity. When Courts find legislation to be unconstitutional they declare it invalid and then direct the Government to fix it. The Court cannot re-draft the legislation itself. In other words, the Courts cannot order the government to increase the lump sum or return to a pension scheme. All the Court has the power under our Constitution to do is to declare that the NVC is unconstitutional and that the government must fix it. There is no guarantee what that fix may be.



This brings us to where we are today. Since Minister O’Toole has been appointed there has been a shift in Veterans Affairs from ignoring or fighting that there is a problem, to acknowledging that there is a problem and wanting to fix it. If the Government is in a position where they are ready and willing to fix it now, rather than 7 years from now when ordered to do so by the Courts, then we truly believe that it is in the best interests of all Veterans to work with them, rather than fight them, to make sure they get the fix right.



The difficulty with ongoing litigation is that the government cannot work with us if we are engaged in litigation. In addition, if we were to be successful after trial and the Court ordered the government to fix the legislation, the government would be under no obligation to seek our input on what the proposed changes would be. By holding the litigation in abeyance we have created the opportunity for our team to be involved in driving what the changes will be. During this period of abeyance, the plaintiffs and their counsel will assess the Government’s implementation of the tabled reforms. We will also provide input to the Government and the Minister of Veterans Affairs as to what additional reforms should be made so that Canada may fully honour the obligations under the Social Covenant. Specifically we will have two representative Plaintiffs working on a stakeholder advisory committee and acting as liaisons between the Veterans community, the government and the legal team regarding reforms that are needed.



It is our view that a negotiated outcome will be the fastest and most effective way to see change.



While it may seem that giving up the “legal fight” for the time being is a loss, we see it as a temporary and necessary measure to try to affect change in the most efficient way. We all know that there are Veterans who are suffering daily without needed benefits and they cannot wait for a seven year legal battle. Change needs to happen now and we see the political process as the best way to achieve that.



In addition, it is important to note that our agreement with the Government does not silence us at all. We have specifically reserved the right for our legal team and representative plaintiffs to continue to comment in the media and raise issues of veterans’ benefits. It is our full intention to stay vocal during the upcoming election and to put our support behind whichever party comes out with the best proposed benefits for Veterans and to challenge the government of the day to do better.



If nothing fruitful comes of this negotiation process, which we view as unlikely, than we just pick back up where we left off in a year. While a year may seem to be a long time, in the lifespan of litigation like this it is only a temporary pause. We are using our experience as legal professionals to look for the best possible outcome for Veterans, and sometimes the best route is not always through litigation. That said, I would reiterate that the litigation is not over and the agreement reached with the Government gives us the right to recommence the action

Please do not hesitate to follow up with any additional questions you may have to our legal team at: veterans@millerthomson.com. We want to be sure that the message that is getting to the veterans community about what this all means is accurate and we are happy to address your concerns.



For additional information, attached is a link to the Global News interview with Miller Thomson counsel, Don Sorochan Q.C. which explains what has happened with the lawsuit:

http://globalnews.ca/video/2030538/veterans-government-put-lawsuit-on-hold

Regards






Kelsey Thompson
Miller Thomson LLP

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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by Riddick on Wed 03 Jun 2015, 18:01

This is from the Equitas Society Facebook page:

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Ottawa+calls+legal+fight+with+injured+veterans/11100471/story.html#__federated=1

This is an excerpt from it; “This minister (new Veterans Affairs Minister Erin O’Toole) has already signalled a fundamental difference of approach by the staff,” Sorochan said. Instead of waiting for veterans to make applications, staff members are now supposed to offer advice on the different options open to them".

I had spoken to the VO about this when he visited Barrie in March......many times a veterans application/claim is submitted years later...........because.....like me, I am ignorant and uneducated/familiar with what is available or what I may or could be entitled to. Because it may be submitted years later we are unfairly judged and accused we are uncredible!

I think .......it is about TIME! Finally something that makes sense and is reasonable.

Read more: http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Ottawa+calls+legal+fight+with+injured+veterans/11100471/story.html#ixzz3c2SMUGJa

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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by Guest on Mon 08 Jun 2015, 06:56

Anybody can be manipulated, i see veterans and their lawyers being manipulated here, or shady back room deals happening. Never trust anybody boys not even your own lawyers their not doing this to help veterans but to further their own interest one way or another!!!

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Re: Veterans, government put benefits lawsuit on hold until after election

Post by Guest on Thu 29 Oct 2015, 21:55

Court cases in limbo as new government prepares to take office:

Veterans’ benefits

Groups and individuals who have launched constitutional challenges or lawsuits against the government will also need to decide if it makes sense to push forward. A good example is the class-action lawsuit launched in 2012 by a group of veterans unhappy with the federal government’s benefits program. It may be dropped depending on the Trudeau government’s actions on the file in the coming months, said the veterans’ lawyer, Donald Sorochan.

“The Liberal platform, on its face, appears to be the most satisfactory in solving the problems,” he said.


http://globalnews.ca/news/2301556/court-cases-in-limbo-as-new-government-prepares-to-take-office/

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