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LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by Guest on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 20:43

teen IF your intentions are to have the PA pension as an option it is in fact a no brainer .

IF they are intent on doing something else it is not .

in my opinion THE ONLY reason they would want to make this complicated is to frack vets once again.

propat

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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by Teentitan on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 20:23

Absolutely Rex! This is where everyone should just bombard Hehr's facebook page, and email. Make sure you CC the Prime Minister.

Transparency my arse!!!
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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by bigrex on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 20:20

This is why we need actual communication from the department. Without it, rumours run rampant, tensions grow, and nothing good happens.
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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by Teentitan on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 20:18

Thank you Johnny you just pointed out ONE of the complexities they are facing to bring back the lifelong pension.

As much as some might think it's a no brainer it is not.

This article was printed in the Hill Times, the political rag read by everyone inside the Ottawa bubble.

VAC is trying to figure out how to do this and they are slowly coming to the realization that they have to merge the PA and NVC. And it is not going to be easy because as pointed out in the article during the NVC the GoC did not go over it clause by clause which created the fubar called the NVC.

So what needs to be done is create a new act and do it right.

Not only do they have to properly merge they have to think of the 10 years of payouts to vets and how do we work it into the plan. If they do it as a going forward act then 10 years of vets have a class action lawsuit which lawfirms will be drooling to get a chunk of.

And if you notice in the last paragraph the Ombudsman is 'reminding' PMT and the Minister that the Liberals have promised an open and transparent government. Read it as "keep the vets informed because you promised you would"

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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by johnny211 on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 19:23

What I say could all be a rumour, but being near the puzzle palace here. I heard from a Vet last wk, who had a bit of inside scoop, or so was heard, yada yada, that they are looking at a combination of a lump sum and mtly payments. But the other thing said was that it will only be for new claims, after this new policy, and not going back. Now this could all be BS too, but just putting it out there..VVV..
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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by Guest on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 19:08

lmao @ pinger ya you know and the political gamesmanship continues .

but I guess seeing what they can get away with is better than them telling you exactly what they are going to get away with when they are going to get away with it and exactly how you should feel about it .

propat

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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by Guest on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 19:01

trooper I have already written up the legislation to do just that payback and all threw in the ELB thing just because it was easy .

he already has that legislation , had it for weeks , sent to him to three of his e-mail accounts .

6 months tops barring problems with the vote itself .

propat

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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by pinger on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 18:59

Just simmering about this article and I hear you czerv. Now I like Guy Parent and feel he's one of the good guys.

Here's something you already know trooper... It ain't complex

Anyway, in the article...

" While there are some items on the list that lend themselves to being achieved in a relatively short time frame (e.g. re-opening Veterans’ offices), there are others of a more complex nature that will take time to get it right (e.g. re-establishing lifelong pensions, as an option). This is important because when issues are complex and interdependent, too much haste and not enough evidence-based analysis can lead to negative outcomes for Veterans. "

I do not like that paragraph, esp. what I underlined. Not at all. Haven't past items of complex nature been reviewed and analyzed to death?
Perhaps some very recent complex items have not.
But if the former has been, why wait for hell to freeze over? Dynamics?
They constantly evolve.
Kinda like shooting a moving target, comes a TIME to shoot, shyte and get off the pot.
Bearing in mind the GoC has the best resources and professionals (Yes,I hear you teentitan...
including the bureaucrats).

Pray tell propat why would you assume... " see what we (they) can GET AWAY WITH ? lmao!

JMO pinger.
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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by Guest on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 18:49

agreed wild thing !!! it should be an option to take the PA pension itself .

cant get anymore equal than that im thinkin .

add to the fact its BY FAR the easiest and fastest way to do this would be a no brainer .

if they decide to go another way it would be a lot more complicated and take a lot more time .

only one reason they would do that would be to save money .

so if they decide to go another way I guarantee you it will NOT be equal . probably not even close .

the last comments from the MVA loosely suggested they may be thinking of heading down that very road .

here is to hoping he was just talking out his but .

but im guessing that along with the non committal DO,s comments were feelers .

by that I mean put the non committal CHEEPER comments out their to see how the vets react . see what we can GET AWAY WITH ?

propat


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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by Guest on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 18:34

I would say the article is sound in pointing out - or acknowledging problems that Veterans had with respect to the NVC in general an dealing with the past government in getting those problems solved.

Surely those in charged of implementing the lifelong pension promise are aware of the reaction that will occur if they drag their feet on this an implement something that does not mirror the disability pension portion part of the PA lifelong pension.

Here is a thought or suggestion on implementing the lifelong pension an please someone explain to me where the complexity of this lies.

The PA which is currently in place for those grandfathered in excluding those released after 2006 comprises of different benefits which are all lifelong Monthly pensions payments an are all tax free.
The way in which this could easily be implemented is simply looking at the pension portion of the PA pension an implement this into the NVC using the exact same percentage rating as the PA pension , keeping it tax free forgive my ignorance here but what is so difficult about that ?
Those who have already received a lump sum an chose to take the lifelong pension would get that pension at the same percentage rating in which they have been qualified using that rate to use with the lifelong pension they now chose to except....those below the 100% rating would be entitled to apply for an increase as their condition or conditions worsen the same way it was for the PA pension.
For the payback amount there's several ways in which this could be accomplish none of which would fall under the word complex.

So please someone enlighten me on the complexity of this...but don't tell me something I do not already know...yes there's legislation to be put forward but legislation is done all the time...an yes we all want this done right....but I fail to understand the complexity of this as the PA pension portion is not something new...it's right there in black an white for all to see...same goes for the payback...this would not be the first time payback is used within Veterans affairs.

Yes I agree it will take some time to accomplish but how much time ?
In my own view the lifelong pension implementation should be in place no later then the end of next year at the very latest.

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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by Guest on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 17:40

The life long pension has to be equal percentage wise to PA pension and tax free. not an option!!!

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Re: LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by czerv on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 15:02

Not impressed with his musing. ....'15 individual commitments that will take FOUR years to implement. He says: 'This is good news': really? then .... 'more complex nature that will take time to get it right"..... ...'needs to be more open and transparent with all information..' Not much of information nor transparency yet.
sounds like he would like to keep his job.
As i said: not impressed.

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LET"S GET VETERANS' ISSUES RIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL THIS TIME

Post by Dannypaj on Sun 13 Dec 2015, 09:50

Let’s get veterans’ issues right this time

Ottawa, ON - December 10, 2015

This text was authored by Guy Parent, Veterans Ombudsman, and originally published in The Hill Times on Monday, December 7, 2015.

It is almost ten years since Parliament unanimously passed the Canadian Forces Members and Veterans Re-establishment and Compensation Act, commonly known as the New Veterans Charter. The rationale for creating this new piece of legislation, which resulted in a new suite of programs, was that the Pension Act was not meeting the immediate needs of modern Veterans and their families at a time when Canada was taking on an increased role in Afghanistan.

Ten years ago, it was seen as visionary in its embrace of the principles of modern disability management. Its overarching focus was on wellness, as opposed to the Pension Act’s concentration on disability. It was to be a ‘living’ Charter with timely updates to balance out its imperfections and keep pace with the evolving needs of Veterans, but that fell by the wayside.

So, what went wrong over the last decade and what do we need to do to get it right this time?

First, the legislation was adopted too fast without a clause-by-clause review in a House of Commons or Senate Committee. Because of this, the sufficiency, adequacy and interrelationships of some of the Charter’s benefits were not fully considered in its design stage. This has resulted in the complex patchwork of benefits we have today – understood by few and delivering sometimes unintentional, negative consequences to Veterans.

Second, despite Veterans and their families, Veterans’ organizations, Veterans’ advocates and my Office repeatedly bringing to decision makers’ attention the gaps in the Charter that need to be closed, these gaps were not addressed fully or in a timely manner to meet the needs of Veterans. The New Veterans Charter never became the ‘living’ document promised.

Third, it often seemed to the Veterans’ community that the only way to achieve change was by publically pressuring the Government. Public pressuring of Government is not something that comes naturally to Veterans; it is not a part of the military ethos. Going forward, Veterans should not be put in a position again whereby they believe that the only way that they can get their message through to Government is by going public.

Fast forward to today. Canadians have elected a new Government and Prime Minister Justin Trudeau has promised real change for Veterans. In his mandate letter to the Honourable Kent Hehr, Minister of Veterans Affairs and Associate Minister of National Defence, he has made public 15 individual commitments that he expects the Minister to deliver on over the next four years. This is good news for Veterans and their families. It gives them a roadmap of this Government’s intent and clear benchmarks to measure progress against.

While there are some items on the list that lend themselves to being achieved in a relatively short time frame (e.g. re-opening Veterans’ offices), there are others of a more complex nature that will take time to get it right (e.g. re-establishing lifelong pensions, as an option). This is important because when issues are complex and interdependent, too much haste and not enough evidence-based analysis can lead to negative outcomes for Veterans. Plus it can overshadow the real opportunity that is before us to provide whole-system change.

To get it right this time, it is important that we focus on outcomes because this forces us to address the complexity of how we do business. For instance, if the focus is on delivering a monthly pension and not lifelong financial security, then we may end up with Veterans in receipt of a monthly pension, but who are not financially secure in their old age. If our goal is to make them financially secure, the monthly pension just becomes one of many ways to achieve that outcome.

The Prime Minister has also pledged that the Government’s work will be informed by performance measurement, evidence, and feedback from Canadians. This too is good news for Veterans and their families, because to get it right this time, evidence-based policies need to be the norm, and tracking outcomes, rather than outputs, should be the performance measure for which we strive.

The Government has also committed to setting a higher bar for openness and transparency, and that is also good news for Veterans. Last week’s Veterans Affairs Canada’s Stakeholders’ Summit set the right starting tone. The Department now needs to build on this foundation and increase its collaboration with Veterans and their families, Veterans’ organizations and Veterans’ advocates to determine how best it can support them. It also needs to be more open and transparent with all information that affects Veterans.

Finally, getting it right is not only about what needs to be done, it is also about how we get it done. If we seriously want to reduce the complexity of benefits and overhaul service delivery for Veterans, it is going to require more than just tinkering with a few benefits, it is going to require a visionary approach. That is why the values framework in the Prime Minister’s mandate letter is an important to guide to all future actions because it provides the important values framework within which the priorities are to be designed and implemented.

What Veterans and their families, as well as Canadians, are going to remember is the end result, and we need to get it right this time.

Guy Parent
Veterans Ombudsman
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