Canadian Soldiers Assistance Team (CSAT) Forum

Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Page 3 of 3 Previous  1, 2, 3

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by Teentitan on Wed 11 May 2016, 13:48

Rags you really need to get off your Wounded Stripe high-horse.

The attitude you have is one of the very core problems with vets fighting vets.

You know absolutely nothing about Perry Gray's condition or mine for that matter.

It's your dinasour mentality of "categorizing" veterans that make advocating that much more harder.

Until you put yourself in a position to openly advocate in front of other veterans not in front of your keyboard you have absolutely no right to question the "street cred" of Perry or myself.

So please do all of us here on CSAT a favor....stop this juvenile campaign that the Wounded Stripe is the trump card that makes you a superior veteran.
avatar
Teentitan
CSAT Member

Number of posts : 3304
Location : ontario
Registration date : 2008-09-19

Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by Rags on Wed 11 May 2016, 13:33

I liked the speech but if its falling on def ears there is a reason so as per normal in any attack find a better way to overwhelm the enemy.
  It is hard to shake lose attention from blurry eyed staffers and politicians unless you have a compelling story line everyone knows that gives you credibility or a visible sign you have credibility like a medal, wound strip or visible scare missing limb etc. Being a VVi or even CSAT dude carries no credibility. Nor does CAV or any of those orgs listed less Wounded Warrior. So was there any rep from any of these orgs talking with visible wound? Medal/strip? Probably not. We have not presented our Audy Murphy to the mic yet, until we do we will not be taken seriously.

I dont want to hurt all your feelings here but we as a veterans community lack credibility with who we present at the mic to the world on our behalf. We dont have the podium impact required to roust the interest of people to listen intently and then to go off and make serious tough changes to DVA. We need Dont think for a second they at the government level CF level or any other level that they dont check your CV before hearing ya speak. Non of the names you listed inspiring you to write this speech have a CV that inspires credibility, not that the content of what you say is not true and dont get me wrong it needs to be said........just by someone else.  Dallire would be only one with credibility (misguided credibility) in the public eye in Canada but in his case he has no credibility with the army or any Euro based country. The others you list who get to be at the podium are the same Richards, Rainville, Bruyea yourself no combat credibility so you wont wow them to listen. Why do you all not get that key point I will never understand? Let me just be crystal clear you are being ignored at the government level for a reason......cause ya have no wow factor not that what your saying is not true or valid.

"Its not what you know but how good you look doing it" Propoganda!!! make the time at the mic count have a better story to tell by a better actor.

Solution.......say the same thing but from people with,.... I hate to say it but it is what it is and its called "Street Creds"

You want someone to talk to a standing committees on PTSD get a badly wounded battle casualty to talk to them and make them stare at his scared face or his discomfort while he adjusts the mic with his prosthetic. All while his medals gleam and show the history of his tours and valour.

On DU have an actually poisoned soldier who fought in a DU area and was actually exposed to it with shrapnel in him who can talk about it with some level of credibility cause ya can see the hole and he can tell the story about the blast that poisoned him. Again as above all while they have to stare at the battle scared mutilated soldier before them.

That is the only approach. But it requires almost everyone that I see yapping at the podium to stop and hand the mic to others.....that wont happen so the world turns and nothing gets done.

"CREDIBILITY" is key

Rags

Rags
CSAT Member

Number of posts : 792
Location : Adrift
Registration date : 2013-01-06

Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by Guest on Wed 11 May 2016, 07:23

again done and done except for my own MP . seems all the heads will take their time but eventually answer me. my own MP doesn't answer AT ALL . seems the MP for Fredericton has absolutely no time for vets or serving military members even though if not for them he would not be the MP.

propat

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by VVice on Wed 11 May 2016, 05:11

If you liked my speech, then send an e-mail to the minister, your MP and the prime minister.  Let them know that you are disappointed with how the government deals with the Veterans Community.

Perry

Chief Editor
VVi representative for VAC stakeholder summits

VVice
CSAT Member

Number of posts : 12
Location : Ottawa
Registration date : 2014-04-09

Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by RCN-Retired on Wed 11 May 2016, 03:24

From experience in other venues I certainly can see and relate. This type of posturing is a military thing, you have very senior staff and instead of remembering your subordinates welfare, to many of them are doing nothing but ass kissing. A difference can be made but the cost is very high, I lived it and have paid the toll. Before Walt there was Admiral Murray who I knew fairly well, I always thought him to be an outstanding leader but when he went to VAC he too forgot where he came from. He left those of us that need help behind. I wrote to him once and told him how disappointing it was. But to no avail, he did not even give me the respect of writing back. I am sure General Walt will follow the party line and leave the soldiers he once lead behind as well. I remember on my SLC the RSM I believe, (Mr. Salany a Lord Stathcona) told us: "to be a great leader is merely giving a damn" I believe I held my end but there are far to many yes men/women that are more concerned about themselves. Ready Aye Ready!
avatar
RCN-Retired
CSAT Member

Number of posts : 254
Location : Vancouver Island
Registration date : 2012-11-14

Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by Teentitan on Wed 11 May 2016, 01:59

As I was not there I would have to go on my past experiences at these Summits when a veteran stands and delivers a "reality check" speech.

It's the older veterans in vet orgs that do not reveal their membership numbers and 'if' they are VAC clients they are entrenched in the PA. FYI there is vet orgs whose president is not even a VAC client and have no real grasp of how VAC works.

I have seen representatives fall asleep. Not say one word. Are at the front of the line for the grip n' grin with the Minister and DM. First out of the room at coffee breaks to get the best pastries. Same conduct at lunch time.

At one of these meetings in PEI I was asked to do a presentation on internet communication. I blasted 75% of the room. Told them straight up their websites f'n sucked. Were completely out of date or didn't even exist! I couldn't express strongly enough that if you want to educate your membership they needed up to date websites, a chat forum and an information page.

They were all eager to create, update, improve their website's until they found out the cost for a server company, the amount of work and time it takes to publish and maintain a website they lost their enthusiasm to do it. Or the cost was too much for the organization because there wasn't enough funds.

These are the organizations VAC drools to bring to the meetings because they "own" them. These vets love to be wined and dined and will never do anything to jeopardize their seat at the table.

This is what real advocates are up against and it is hard to keep your composure and respect in check. Nothing worse then having these veterans at the table shaming another veteran for standing up and telling the truth on an issue. All VAC ADM's, DM, Minister, COS people just sit back and watch vets eating vets to the point where they step in to "calm" the room. That is when the point of the speech goes straight down the craper and the VAC controlled meeting gets back on track.

avatar
Teentitan
CSAT Member

Number of posts : 3304
Location : ontario
Registration date : 2008-09-19

Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by Guest on Wed 11 May 2016, 00:05

upset with this after 10 fracking years of BS ? what do these guys expect anyway ? I thought it was outstanding . I also thought it was well measured not sure if I could have managed being quite so polite. I mean after 10 years and still with the dog and ponies and not real fixes ? common time to crap ore get off the pot.

now im curious as to what vets orgs were upset by this .

propat

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by RCN-Retired on Tue 10 May 2016, 23:38

Well I for one loved the speech, the truth hurts at times and these fu-tarts need to be told the straight facts. What a waste of tax deduction dollars bringing that circus to town. Our minister along with General Walt should be ashamed of themselves.
avatar
RCN-Retired
CSAT Member

Number of posts : 254
Location : Vancouver Island
Registration date : 2012-11-14

Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by Teentitan on Tue 10 May 2016, 23:26

VVi's Chief Editor Perry Gray wrote and delivered it. It seems there were some vet orgs very upset and the Minister as well.
avatar
Teentitan
CSAT Member

Number of posts : 3304
Location : ontario
Registration date : 2008-09-19

Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by RCN-Retired on Tue 10 May 2016, 22:45

Who gave this speech please? And were all the so called stakeholders present?
avatar
RCN-Retired
CSAT Member

Number of posts : 254
Location : Vancouver Island
Registration date : 2012-11-14

Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by Rifleman on Tue 10 May 2016, 21:29

Outstanding sure glad you have our backs Trooper and I thank you for your dedication and hard work to try and make things right for all vetrans PRO PATRIA

Rifleman
CSAT Member

Number of posts : 613
Location : facebook
Registration date : 2013-05-15

Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by Guest on Tue 10 May 2016, 19:39

OUTSTANDING !!!!!!!!!!!!!

best thing I have read here in a long time .

again

OUTSTANDING!!!!!!

always question authority

propat

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by Guest on Tue 10 May 2016, 19:14

This is the speech that I was allowed to make during the Stakeholder Summit 9-10 May.  It was fueled by 14 years of frustration trying to collaborate with VAC.  It was also inspired by a lot of people including Sean Bruyea, Jenny Migneault , Louise Richard, Romeo Dallaire, the staff of Veteran Voice, and the members and supporters of the Veterans Community.


Once again you have gathered us under false pretenses.  You call this a stakeholders summit, and yet you really do not want us to participate in the event.  Our input is limited to a few minutes during the break-out sessions and the observers among us are not allowed to speak at all.  How is this truly a part of the consultation process?  Rather it is a very bad example of Canadian democracy.  Are we not entitled to the same respect as your colleagues in Parliament, who are allowed to speak in committees and in the respective houses?

You were mandated to have constructive dialogue with Canadians, civil society, and stakeholders.  

A stakeholders summit should be about the stakeholders priorities and not VAC priorities.

You want to be treated with respect as an honourable minister.  Such respect must be earned first.  Veterans know that they may salute the rank of their superiors, but they expect those same superiors to earn the respect of their subordinates.  It is known as leadership by example.

Start treating us with respect, and we may reciprocate.  Instead this event is a form of intimidation with a smile and you are marginalising the clients who you supposedly serve.

There is much fluff, no substance and certainly no accountability regarding ideas put forward from the last meeting.  This is not the agenda of a stakeholder summit that seeks to address the most pressing concerns of injured veterans and their families. Does that mean that all the breakout group efforts that were worked upon in the last summit are thrown into file 13? This is clearly about stakeholder control and distraction. For those who don't really care about addressing the issues affecting the most important stakeholder, i.e., injured veterans and their families, this summit is a perfect sit back and feel good, feel nice, like you're part of something that looks important but means nothing.

Are these summits along with the six announced policy groups about meaningful stakeholder consultation that produces needed and timely change or merely public relations exercises to ensure media and stakeholder control?

We do not know what is meant by the word stakeholder and few have been contacted by your Stakeholder Engagement and Outreach team to explain why we were selected and what to expect from these summits.  Frankly this is typical of the poor communication skills exhibited by your subordinates.

According to your staff, there is no definition of stakeholder, but this is not true:

“Departmental stakeholders” are restricted to registered lobbyists, their employees and corporations employing lobbyists as well as “individuals employed in, contracted by, or who otherwise represent corporations and organizations that have current or anticipated official dealings” with government.”

Given this definition, either most of us should not be here or you have incorrectly labeled us.

You have included the following:

clients like me
research groups like CIMVIR
commemorative groups
Canadian Corps of Commissionaires
charities
private groups
advocacy groups and individual advocates
lobbists
OVO

You had better explain why we were selected and what we are doing here.

If these summits and groups are closed to most veterans, then participation should require a minimum of either an actively involved community directly affected by VAC policies and programs or a recognized expertise and/or knowledge-base to understand the importance and impact of such policies. Arguably, many invited organizations have neither.

You keep doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different outcome, but this is insanity.  It does not matter who says things, they are repeating what other VAC personnel have already said.  Every new minister has to have sufficient time to settle into the job before we should expect anything.  Again this is a fallacious argument because most ministers are never in the job long enough.  It is likely that you will move on before fulfilling your mandate.

I was told that the agenda was only finalised last Friday, despite the fact that this summit has been planned for over a month.  Do you expect us to believe that the agenda was not ready after the speakers for this summit were selected?  If they had enough time to prepare for this, then why were we not given the same respect?  The agenda was also developed from the last summit and yet there is an obvious lack of continuity.  This is the same format as the previous summit that I attended in April 2015. How is repeating the format of the previous government an example of the Prime Minister's statement that you will be held accountable for your commitment to bring a different style of leadership to government.  Many of the most important issues are not being addressed and the subjects of the presentations seem odd choices as replacements.

For example the budget, we have no input in this.  Why do you think that this should be the first topic?

You would need days to fully explore your budget.  It would be better to discuss Re-establishment of lifelong pensions as stated in your mandate letter.

Why are you presenting on medical marijuana when there is a departmental review going on? You are projecting the outcome of the review with your own opinion by discussing it. Why is it okay to talk about this but not other topics? Why are we expected to be here for a second day while your staff fiddle about to have a 90 minute Facebook session.  What is our role, to amuse ourselves?  You do not need us as a captive audience when you could do this undefined activity at any time.

There is also no discussion of what has happened since the last summit.  And it would be nice to know what you have been doing behind closed doors contrary to the Open and Accountable Government.  I draw your attention in particular to the Ethical Guidelines set out in Annex A of that document, which apply to you and your staff.  For example, you and the Justice Minister recently entered into an agreement to dismantle the VAC stand-alone, legal services unit - in existence since the department was formed. It appears you agreed to transfer responsibility for providing VAC legal services to a federal department in Ottawa - Employment and Social Development Canada (ESDC).   Why???

It would be nice if everyone here was privy to the contents of  “Open and Accountable Government” so that we can monitor your compliance.

What about homeless vets, the seamless transition from DND to VAC, the Equitas lawsuit, hiring of staff, the six advisory groups and other very important issues?

On the topic of hiring or re-hiring, will you ensure that Veterans are given a priority for all jobs?  And if not, why not?  How many people have been hired and what are their jobs?  Why do you continue to employ people who have not satisfactorily performed their assigned duties?  What have you done to reduce the stressful working conditions for front-line employees?

On the topic of the advisory groups, why do we not know their composition, mandates, terms of reference and other important information.  Why did the members have to sign non-disclosure agreements?  Again this is in contravention of your government's policy on transparency and accountability.  

One concern that I have which affects all of your clients, is the ongoing privacy scandal.  You are allowing the Royal Canadian Legion access to client personal information.  Rather than improving security, you have been a collaborator in reducing security.  Having had unauthorised people examine my own file, I am again shocked by this recent revelation.  Here we are years after your department was to have solved its privacy problems and the solutions have not been implemented fully.  If you are not competent to safeguard our information, it is highly likely there are other problems.

These summits should be the forum in which you report to Veterans on your progress toward fulfilling your commitments and to help develop effective measures that asses the impact of the organisations for which you are answerable.  If the format of the two summits of which you have been minister are examples of your leadership and response to your mandate from the Prime Minister,  then you have failed to provide a change in leadership and failed to obey the Prime Minister.  Do not blame your failures on lack of time or others.  The buck stops at your desk, no one else's.

If you want to immediately prove me wrong then scrap this agenda and have a frank conversation with us.  Tell your subordinates to take notes and be prepared to help you provide us with information.  Tell us why you deserve to continue as our minister.  Tell us when you will complete your mandate and what else you will do, not plan to try, to lay the building blocks for a higher standard of service that will address our needs.  Tell us that you are truly listening to Veterans and other Canadians.

I strongly disagree with your philosophy that this is a game and that it is less important whether win or lose, but it is the exercise.  No, it is important that Veterans are winners and they are not playing your game.  I watched your inspirational video on Youtube.

Remember Kent for whom you work. You work for your clients, and we do not work for you, but we can work with you, if you earn our respect and trust.

I will not belabour you anymore with such concerns, but this is what I expect from you:

a letter to all veterans apologising to them for your failure to deliver on the mandate letter from the Prime Minister in a timely manner;

a letter to me apologising for aggravating my medical conditions;

compensation for this aggravation and wasting my time; and

a private meeting with you so that we can discuss at length my other concerns.

If you are unwilling to do this, then I expect your letter of resignation to the Prime Minister.  You can go try to be a minister of another department more suited to your abilities.

This will not be the only time that you will hear this veteran's voice.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: Speech From our VVi's Chief Editor / Given at the Stakeholders Summit 9-10 May 2016

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 3 of 3 Previous  1, 2, 3

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum