Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

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Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by Guest on Thu 21 Jul 2016, 18:38

Dear Mr. xxxxxxx

On behalf of the Honourable Kent Hehr, this is in response to your
e-mail
inquiring about retroactive increases to the disability award. Your
correspondence regarding the re-establishment of lifelong pensions,
which was forwarded by the offices of the Prime Minister and the
Minister of National Defence, has also been received.

The disability award granted under the Canadian Forces Members and
Veterans Re-establishment and Compensation Act is a tax-free, lump-sum
benefit that recognizes the non-economic impacts of a service-related
injury, including pain and suffering. Since 2006, the year the Act came
into force, the amount of the disability award has been indexed annually
in accordance with changes to the Consumer Price Index (CPI). As you
know, in Budget 2016, the Government of Canada proposed to raise the
value of the disability award to a maximum of $360,000 and index this
amount to inflation.

Effective April 1, 2017, the maximum Disability Award amount of
$360,000 will be used to establish new rate tables for the Disability
Award starting with the year it was implemented, 2006, through to 2016
using the Consumer Price Index. This will result in the maximum amount
payable for a 100% assessment, for example, being higher than $250,000.
As such, the difference between the amount of the new rate tables and
the original Disability Award received will be calculated for each
individual assessment. The total of all the differences, between the
original Disability Award assessments and the assessments under the new
rate tables, will be the amount that is paid to an individual. As a
result, Veterans assessed at 100% who received a Disability Award in
2006, may in fact receive more than $110,000.

I would like to assure you that Veterans Affairs Canada will contact
those who received the disability award prior to April 1, 2017, about
their eligibility for a supplementary payment. However, the Department
will not be able to calculate the revised rates until early next year
when the CPI figure for 2016 is known.

As for lifelong pensions, the Government has engaged in
consultations—with input from the Veteran community—to develop an
option that best meets the needs of those who sacrificed so much to
defend the freedom that all Canadians enjoy today.

Thank you for writing, and I trust that the information provided is
helpful.

Sincerely,


Janice Burke
for

Bernard J. Butler
Assistant Deputy Minister
Strategic Policy and Commemoration


Janice Burke

Team 2020
Care. Compassion. Respect

Équipe 2020
Soins. Compassion. Respect

Veterans Affairs Canada/Anciens Combattants Canada


I may now be more confused than when I started but this is what I got .

propat

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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by Bruce72 on Thu 21 Jul 2016, 23:11

What was the max rate for 2008 and 2009?

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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by Bruce72 on Thu 21 Jul 2016, 23:16

So if I understand correctly. The max rate for 2017 of $360,000 minus 2006 max rate at $250,000 equals $110,000 not taking into account inflation.

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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by Guest on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 09:50

well bruce we have been through this when they came out with the poorly written legislation .

and as it stands now we are still not sure what it all means and probably will not until the regulations come out .

if this person is accurate thou it illuminates a lot of possibilities .

my best guess the amount in this case would be 110,000 plus cola for 2016.

propat

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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by bigrex on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 13:08

I would love to see someone get $110000 from the top up, because that would mean that everyone would be topped up to the 2017 rate. But if that was the case, they wouldn't have stated in the legislation that the amount would be reduced by the annual COLA amount, back to the year the lump sum was received. I think they will be maxed out between $40K and $50K. What I think they need to do, is release the new updated 2006 rate chart, and from that everyone would be able to calculate what they should receive.

I also want to see some sort of confirmation from the Ministers office, that this top up does not mean that those who have been injured since 2006, will be left out when the life long pension is introduced. As of yet, we have not had that reassurance.
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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by Guest on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 13:55

bigex unfortunately the legislation was written so poorly that its hard to glean the actual meaning of that part without the regulations .

now I said from the start this looks more like a cola recovery part nothing more so people don't get double cola . then again it is written so poorly it is impossible to tell for sure
.
is your idea of a pro rated system being at the heart of that part of the legislation possible?

sure it could be when you brought it up I thought that may be very likely as well with some reservations witch I told you about but I thought it about as likely as my theory so much so I was concerned enough about it to wright long  letters with one question at the end dumbed way the frack down to a simple yes or no answer so the recipient cant send back a too horribly convoluted response .

will a member that recived a 100% buyout in 2006 get $110,000 backpay ?

again this is probably the poorest piece of legislation I have EVER read when it comes to meaning and clarity so I can probably pull another dozen plausible explanations for that part right clean out of my butt , but until the regulations come out I'm not sure we will know the true meaning of it with any degree of certainty .

IF this response from the ministers office is an honest one and I think we are ok . and we can estimate any retro by the way I originally proposed .

if not we got to wait for the regs.

propat

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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by bigrex on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 18:58

"the maximum Disability Award amount of $360,000 will be used to establish new rate tables for the Disability Award starting with the year it was implemented, 2006, through to 2016
using the Consumer Price Index."

So to me, this means that there will a new starting point for 2006, increased from the original $250000 maximum, and that each subsequent year will be adjusted by CPI, until you reach the promised $360000 amount. Just using the existing CPI increases, that amount would be roughly $290000, but that amount will drop if they add in the 2017 CPI increase. The higher the next CPI increase, the smaller the top up amount will be.
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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by Guest on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 19:30

well buds if you are taking this reply as truthful you are taking an exert of the reply I received and just using that for your analysis .

try using the entire reply with such things contained in it such as " Veterans assessed at 100% who received a Disability Award in
2006, may in fact receive more than $110,000." to produce a thesis reflective of the message not one that contradicts even itself .

establishing RATE TABLES does not mean establishing the full buyout retro amount if they are sticking to legislation definitions .

buds again without the regulations its hard to say but this still looks to me as cola recovery for this poorly written piece of crap .

the thing is you are focusing on that one crappy statement in the legislation as well without considering that in this legislation the buyout is also indexed to inflation as well so whatever the buyout retro is and I think your numbers are accurate in that effect after that you will still have to calculate cola on to that number to get the actual retro !!!!

and that buds pretty much coincides with the entirety of the response I relived as well as what I have been saying all along .

propat




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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by pinger on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 20:54

Perhaps I am wrong here as I am not involved with the buyout. (peeves me off though)
However, for any of us to frick or frack assumptions scratch upon that kind of a GoC reply
(Very vague and BS) is pointless to me.

Push the card and OUR energies to the sender.
Putting THEIR feet to fire can be much more effective...

Politically correct for now... snickers included.

My 2 cents
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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by pinger on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 20:59

Hope I made sense.
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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by bigrex on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 21:16

Yes Propat, but they are not going to pay COLA, for years after the payments were made. If they increase the 100% amount in 2006 to $290000, but a Veteran was awarded their lump sum in 2009, they will take $290000, and add the CPI for 2007 (2.2917%), 2008 (2%) and 2009 (2.5%), putting a 100% lump sum award in 2009 at $303197. The top up would be the difference between that and what was originally paid in 2009, which was approximately $267000. I'm not grasping at straws, to fit into my theory. I'm taking what they are saying, comparing that to the legislation, and looking at other examples of dirty tricks VAC has used to reduce their financial liability to come up with a logical estimate of what to expect. I would rather everyone plans for the worst case scenario, and be pleasantly surprised if I'm wrong, than plan for a windfall, then feel screwed over if I was right.
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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by bigrex on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 21:21

But like I said before, I'm just hoping that they are not providing this top up, as compensation for excluding us from the new monthly pension, once it is introduced.
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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by Guest on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 21:27

ya ya dis pinger that's why I stated above " IF this response from the ministers office is an honest one " (ya notice I stressed the if) and is why I continually stress this is such a botched piece of legislation we will not no ANYHING for sure until we see the regs .

but the thing is we were questioning what THE LEGISLATION meant . AND THAT my friend is worth fricking and fracking about .

best to stop a bad piece of legislation BEFORE its passed than AFTER its much easies .

for that ya really need to know if it is in fact good or bad .

the GOC don't like to tip their hand either way moast of the time so ya gotta prod .

one thing I do know is the proposed legislation says they will apply COLA to the buyout without a start date ore cut off date .

so whatever buyout you get beit 50 k or 110 k if your retro and calculation sheet doesn't include COLA you ARE still entitled to it .

if ya get a 50 k increase on your buyout and then they apply COLA and add that to your buyout to give you your retro your good .

if they give you a 110 k increase on your buyout and add NO COLA to your retro THEY STILL OWE YOU COLA .

if they don't give it you go to court to get it and ya don't need a lawyer ya just need your calc sheet and a very small piece of the legislation you WILL GET THE COLA on the 110 k hands down !!!!

always fracking question authority

propat






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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by Guest on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 21:44

bigrex you said " Yes Propat, but they are not going to pay COLA, for years after the payments were made. "

but bigrex that's EXACTLY what the legislation states their IS NOT START OR CUT OFF DATE in the legislation when it refers to COLA .

THEY by the proposed legislation ARE legally obligated to apply it not to the table but the ACTUAL BENIFIT ITSELF seriously read it again .

if my theory is correct it not only corresponds to the response I received but to the legislation TO THE LETTER .

do I think this is the easiest way to do this ????


frack NOOOOO not in a longshot I wold have written the legislation differently for sure but I'm sure the idiot lawyers in the DOJ have a good reason for doing so I suppose and hey I'm just an infantry CPL for 20 fracking years so what the frack do I know .

to me its still a COLA recovery thing like I said from day one but your theory may be correct as well only the regulations will truly tell I think .

propat

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Re: Response to buyout increase question and lifelong pension question

Post by johnny211 on Fri 22 Jul 2016, 21:57

bigrex - In the back of my jumbled mind, I had the same thought as you about this retro. Are they going to pull another fast one, and wait to announce the life long, after the retro is paid out. That way , maybe if you are given the retro, you will be screwed out of the lifelong? Or am I totally of my head on this one? VVV...
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